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[Music]

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welcome to the skeptic zone the podcast

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from Australia for science and reason

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[Music]

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yes it's the skeptic zone podcast

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episode number 467 for the 1st of

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October 2017 Richardson is here with you

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from Sydney Australia bright sunny

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where's the rain where where is the rain

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we haven't had rain for a while things

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are getting a little bit dry a little

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bit dry with record-breaking heat days

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last month and dry conditions we think

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the summer is going to be problematic

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but Australia is a continent of extremes

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I guess we'll see how that goes

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coming up this week on the skeptic zone

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I talked to author and public speaker

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Stephen Colgan now I met Stephen some

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years back at QED QED in Manchester

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where he was one of the speakers and his

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talks so impressed me but I've been well

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more or less

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trying to catch up with him ever since

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for an interview I got that interview

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and Stephens gonna talk to us about his

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method of problem solving solving

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problems before they start and about his

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book why did the policeman cross the

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road and his forthcoming book a murder

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to die for what a fascinating bloke I'm

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sure he is a direct descendant of sure

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comes some mystical way probably somehow

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I think you'll enjoy this interview with

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Stephen Coggan following that it's a

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message a news item from the Australian

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skeptics they are offering grants yes

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wait if you're in Australia and you have

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a skeptical activity you think needs

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funding the Australian skeptics might be

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able to come to your aid news on the

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Australian skeptics grants coming up a

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bit later

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then it's brouhaha science from the

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Australia science TV and this week Casey

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Harrigan says happy birthday to Michael

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Faraday happy birthday Michael Faraday

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then it's a grain of salt with Iran's

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together he's continuing interviews from

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the European skeptics Congress just over

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and I hear it was a great success this

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week Iran chats declare Klingenberg

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before and then just after the Congress

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now Claire's been a guest on the show Oh

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quite a number of times now and it's

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always great to hear her voice

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find out how Claire thought the Congress

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went and in the coming weeks you Ron

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he sent me lots of interviews in fact a

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little bit of a little bit of a spoiler

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alert next week Iran catches up with

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James Randi and then in the weeks

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following all sorts of other great

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people after that it's a little item

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about homeopathy and I'm shocked to read

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that homeopathy is still nonsense

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mmm that's a never-ending saga it's an

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evergreen it's an unsinkable rubber duck

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in a pond full of homeopathic water then

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to round off the show again from the

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European skeptics Congress its susan

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gerbic from guerrilla skepticism on

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wikipedia and she's going to have a

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brief chat to Mentalist and paranormal

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investigator jacob croolik about

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exorcism and she also catches up with

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some of her online editors at guerrilla

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skepticism who were at the Congress now

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here's a little correction a correction

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from me last week I told you about the

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Australian skeptics bent spoon award and

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some of the nominations being made and I

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mentioned that one of the one of the

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nominations was for the ABC TV program

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Lateline that was incorrect it was

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actually ABC TVs program land line not

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late line I misread my script so

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apologies to the late line program a

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fine program indeed but the nomination

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is for ABC TV's land line program for a

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story extolling the dubious virtues of

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biodynamic farming and the wonders of

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burying cow horns full of manure to help

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whine and grow so that's the nomination

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for land line not late line oh and by

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the way there's a new nomination up on

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the Australian skeptics web page for the

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bed spoon for the Metatron the

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bizarre device that you hook up to your

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head and scans your body with magical

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frequencies and you can see your

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internal organs down to the level of

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your DNA Metatron worth checking out

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that's in the running for the bed spoon

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wood now just a reminder and in case you

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didn't know that the Australian skeptics

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have a weekly radio segment on radio 2gb

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in Sydney which is network through the

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Macquarie network around Australia and

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of course it's available online and you

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can hear the archives of those sessions

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at 2gb comm if you just go there and

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search for Saunders or skeptics or

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Mendham Tim Mendham of course Tim and I

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take a sort of a tag team he'll do some

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weeks and I'll do some weeks and we

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really appreciate it thank you very much

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to Mike Williams who's they been in the

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Australian entertainment industry for

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many years and he does the overnight

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weekend show and it's great fun to be on

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the show with Mike Williams chatting

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about all sorts of things and the latest

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segment just went out last night in fact

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was about crop circles I'll put a link

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in the show notes so that's late night

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early morning skeptics on the radio in

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fact you can listen to that live

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anywhere in the world via 2g be calm

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stay tuned to the end of the show with

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my loose ends segment where we tie up

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the loose ends from the show including a

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message from the new platform we're

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trying the new app voice bite I got a

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voice bite message with a question and I

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think you're all especially if you're

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intending to come to skeptic on in

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November here in Sydney I think you'll

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all be interested in this in this

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question stay tuned for that but for now

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but for now it's time for me to run

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downstairs rapey lolly jar the candy jar

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the sweetie jar and get some of that

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incredibly delicious red licorice I

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don't know if you've tried red licorice

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it's sort of raspberry flavored oh what

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a combination here why not well I do

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[Music]

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joining me now all the way from the UK

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its author and public speaker Steven

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Cogan hello Steven hello hello great to

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catch up with you again now we have met

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we met at QED in Manchester or must have

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been about 2014 I think it was the

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Attica yeah yeah to entice you onto the

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sceptic zone I mentioned to you that of

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all the hundreds of talks I've seen

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around the world in skeptic conventions

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going back decades probably one of the

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standout ones was the presentation you

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gave at QED and I know that because I

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can still remember large sections of it

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large swathes of your presentation so

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well done well done indeed that's very

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kind and we didn't decide whether in

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sterling or Australian dollars or no

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yeah it was it was a nice gig that was a

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nice although it did cause me may not

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really it did cause me a little bit of

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hassle for about three months afterwards

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because yeah because right at the end of

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the talk Richard Dawkins who was in the

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front row stood up and thanked me for it

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said he really enjoyed it he then

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tweeted the same and my follow account

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on Twitter went up by about 200 people

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and there were 200 Dawkins haters yeah

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Dawkins it's only nice about him let's

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troll him now and yeah I just had all

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these sort of Flat Earth lunatics and

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and and sort of anti evolution people

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just just constantly bombarding me with

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tweets and links to websites to show me

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the evolutions evil and wrong yeah so

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it's a it's a mixed blessing having a

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well done from bookings I have to say

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how about that because I remember that

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the exact event when Richard Dawkins

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stood up and congratulated you on your

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talk now you were talking you gave a

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talk based on a book you've written

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called why did the policeman cross the

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road

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yeah the title why did the policeman

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cross the road came up because it's a

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story basically of moving from a

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different viewpoint to policing because

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uh

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I was a police officer in London for 30

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years and and when I first joined the

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police was very much a responsive

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organization you know someone someone

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dialed as it is here 999 and you know

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the police term and dealt with the call

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and there was very little going on in

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terms of preventative work in fact most

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London's divided up into 32 boroughs and

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on those 32 boroughs they usually only

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one police officer who's got any kind of

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responsibility for crime prevention and

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everyone else is just mopping up after

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the crimes happened and I kind of went

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on a journey across that 30 years

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realizing that what we should be doing

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is this is me crossing the road from

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sort of reactive to proactive what we

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should be doing is actually stopping the

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crimes from happening because if you if

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you if you take a representative sample

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of you know 150 people in the street and

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you say to them you know would you

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rather the police are really really

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effective use their money effectively

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you know and a really good at catching

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bad guys and them in prison or would you

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rather that you didn't get robbed in the

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first place I know what everyone would

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go for you know there are all sorts of

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problems inherent with it because it's

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very easy to measure success in terms of

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things like arrests and successful

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prosecutions and prison populations and

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all that sort of thing it's it's very

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difficult by comparison to measure

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prevention whether what you've done is

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responsible for a downturn in crime

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figures and whether those crimes would

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have happened had you not done what

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you've done which was why it was always

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a bit of an uphill battle but that's

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kind of what the book was about it's

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about a journey and realizing that what

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policing should be about and indeed what

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policing was set up for if you go back

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to the very origins of organized

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policing back in the 1800s and Sir

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Robert Peel that the very first mission

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statement for policing which became the

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template for what was then the whole

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British Empire starts by saying that the

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primary object of an efficient police is

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the prevention of crime you know it says

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that that's what yeah that's what the

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police was set up for and its second

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purpose is to is to investigate crimes

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and track down and prosecute offenders

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when crimes have been committed but the

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primary object is prevent

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right and yet when I joined in 1980

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there was almost no prevention going on

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at all so that was the thrust of the

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book and and this attitude is what led

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you to help in these situations with the

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flats and using dogs yeah yeah well the

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one you mentioned with the the dogs that

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but that was a particularly troublesome

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housing estate in South London that had

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had an emerging gang problem I mean

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nothing of the scale that you gave me is

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like LA and things like that but

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nevertheless an emerging problem where a

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lot of disenfranchised kids who had

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absent fathers whose mothers quite often

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00:12:14,680 --> 00:12:11,450
were absent or working all day alcoholic

275
00:12:16,810 --> 00:12:14,690
or for whatever reason didn't have any a

276
00:12:18,010 --> 00:12:16,820
large degree of control over them

277
00:12:19,930 --> 00:12:18,020
we're actually sort of forming their own

278
00:12:21,400 --> 00:12:19,940
families and the form of these these

279
00:12:23,590 --> 00:12:21,410
kids that hang out together and

280
00:12:26,350 --> 00:12:23,600
eventually you know a strong individual

281
00:12:27,640 --> 00:12:26,360
who has a more criminal mind basically

282
00:12:30,460 --> 00:12:27,650
starts pushing him down the line at

283
00:12:32,610 --> 00:12:30,470
becoming a gang and this was an emerging

284
00:12:34,600 --> 00:12:32,620
problem there have been a few stabbings

285
00:12:36,880 --> 00:12:34,610
there have been a lot more stabbings

286
00:12:38,950 --> 00:12:36,890
than had been reported to police

287
00:12:40,630 --> 00:12:38,960
I found that looking at alternative

288
00:12:44,320 --> 00:12:40,640
sources of information such as talking

289
00:12:45,910 --> 00:12:44,330
to the casualty departments accident

290
00:12:47,680 --> 00:12:45,920
emergency in the local hospital revealed

291
00:12:49,660 --> 00:12:47,690
a lot more stabbing injuries than had

292
00:12:51,250 --> 00:12:49,670
ever been reported to police so the

293
00:12:54,280 --> 00:12:51,260
problem was much worse than we thought

294
00:12:57,910 --> 00:12:54,290
it was and and it all culminated in a

295
00:13:01,210 --> 00:12:57,920
young lad getting killed by a rival gang

296
00:13:03,700 --> 00:13:01,220
and that's when everyone politicians

297
00:13:05,410 --> 00:13:03,710
local politicians and council they just

298
00:13:08,080 --> 00:13:05,420
really set out to notice that something

299
00:13:11,170 --> 00:13:08,090
needed to be done I think what upset the

300
00:13:12,850 --> 00:13:11,180
most was when the funeral took place was

301
00:13:15,460 --> 00:13:12,860
the fact that the lads coffin was being

302
00:13:17,350 --> 00:13:15,470
carried by members of his gang wearing

303
00:13:19,660 --> 00:13:17,360
sort of bandanas over their faces rather

304
00:13:22,240 --> 00:13:19,670
than family because he had no family the

305
00:13:23,710 --> 00:13:22,250
gang was his family and it was it was a

306
00:13:27,790 --> 00:13:23,720
very political hot potato at the time

307
00:13:29,050 --> 00:13:27,800
and so they asked the little team that I

308
00:13:33,640 --> 00:13:29,060
work with at Scotland Yard to have a

309
00:13:35,230 --> 00:13:33,650
look at it and as we've often found when

310
00:13:38,110 --> 00:13:35,240
we've looked at communities like the

311
00:13:40,180 --> 00:13:38,120
reason the gangs get a toehold and the

312
00:13:41,770 --> 00:13:40,190
reason they get to control things is

313
00:13:43,310 --> 00:13:41,780
that the community is very fractured

314
00:13:46,310 --> 00:13:43,320
this particular

315
00:13:48,950 --> 00:13:46,320
eight I mean London's a real melting pot

316
00:13:51,200 --> 00:13:48,960
anyway I mean there's over 120 languages

317
00:13:53,960 --> 00:13:51,210
spoken in London and this estate had had

318
00:13:56,570 --> 00:13:53,970
three or four distinct cliques and they

319
00:13:57,800 --> 00:13:56,580
kept to themselves they didn't mix and

320
00:14:00,590 --> 00:13:57,810
in amongst it all were these were these

321
00:14:03,140 --> 00:14:00,600
kids you know who nearly all had absent

322
00:14:05,900 --> 00:14:03,150
parents usually an absent father right

323
00:14:08,090 --> 00:14:05,910
and and the community was very fractured

324
00:14:10,460 --> 00:14:08,100
and what we found in previous instances

325
00:14:12,320 --> 00:14:10,470
that weren't quite as serious as this is

326
00:14:14,630 --> 00:14:12,330
that if he started to fix the community

327
00:14:15,170 --> 00:14:14,640
he started people looking out for each

328
00:14:17,840 --> 00:14:15,180
other

329
00:14:19,430 --> 00:14:17,850
crime drops rapidly I mean you're

330
00:14:21,170 --> 00:14:19,440
probably member there's a little story

331
00:14:23,240 --> 00:14:21,180
in the book about just simple things

332
00:14:24,440 --> 00:14:23,250
like pulling enabled neighbors plastic

333
00:14:26,690 --> 00:14:24,450
wheelie bin off the street

334
00:14:28,430 --> 00:14:26,700
once the dustman have been round can

335
00:14:29,870 --> 00:14:28,440
reduce burglaries because the burglars

336
00:14:32,600 --> 00:14:29,880
used the bins they're out on the street

337
00:14:33,680 --> 00:14:32,610
to figure out who's not at home oh you

338
00:14:35,930 --> 00:14:33,690
can guess they haven't taken their bin

339
00:14:37,220 --> 00:14:35,940
bin and just putting it a bit of

340
00:14:39,050 --> 00:14:37,230
community spirit and getting you to take

341
00:14:40,970 --> 00:14:39,060
your neighbors bins in reduces you know

342
00:14:43,970 --> 00:14:40,980
it reduced burglary by 40 50 percent in

343
00:14:45,800 --> 00:14:43,980
times so we thought how can we bring

344
00:14:47,840 --> 00:14:45,810
this community together it was very very

345
00:14:49,400 --> 00:14:47,850
broken yeah no one talked to anyone they

346
00:14:51,440 --> 00:14:49,410
cross the street to avoid each other a

347
00:14:52,940 --> 00:14:51,450
lot of people too scared to go out there

348
00:14:55,730 --> 00:14:52,950
were certain areas that were almost like

349
00:14:57,500 --> 00:14:55,740
no-go areas that no one went to finding

350
00:14:58,850 --> 00:14:57,510
points of commonality is very different

351
00:15:00,230 --> 00:14:58,860
it's very difficult when you've got

352
00:15:02,540 --> 00:15:00,240
people from a lot of different ethnic

353
00:15:05,360 --> 00:15:02,550
groups and and we tried different things

354
00:15:08,080 --> 00:15:05,370
we tried a World Food Day which didn't

355
00:15:10,280 --> 00:15:08,090
work very well we tried using an old

356
00:15:13,310 --> 00:15:10,290
abandoned shop as a kind of community

357
00:15:19,790 --> 00:15:13,320
center or a youth club and someone burnt

358
00:15:22,250 --> 00:15:19,800
it down and then one day we were walking

359
00:15:23,980 --> 00:15:22,260
around that estate myself and a

360
00:15:26,780 --> 00:15:23,990
colleague and a couple of the local

361
00:15:28,310 --> 00:15:26,790
police offices and we're just trying to

362
00:15:29,900 --> 00:15:28,320
think of this any points of commonality

363
00:15:31,460 --> 00:15:29,910
and then and I can't remember to this

364
00:15:33,590 --> 00:15:31,470
day which one of us said it I'm pretty

365
00:15:34,880 --> 00:15:33,600
sure it wasn't me but certainly one of

366
00:15:36,560 --> 00:15:34,890
the little group of four of us who were

367
00:15:40,250 --> 00:15:36,570
walking around noticed that almost

368
00:15:41,720 --> 00:15:40,260
everyone we could see had a dog and my

369
00:15:43,430 --> 00:15:41,730
colleague who worked in the

370
00:15:46,060 --> 00:15:43,440
problem-solving unit with me suddenly

371
00:15:50,390 --> 00:15:46,070
sort of said what about a dog show

372
00:15:51,980 --> 00:15:50,400
we saw saw dog show really but the more

373
00:15:54,740 --> 00:15:51,990
we thought about it we thought well dogs

374
00:15:56,330 --> 00:15:54,750
are a great bridge you know if I if I

375
00:15:56,519 --> 00:15:56,340
see someone across the road who's you

376
00:15:57,900 --> 00:15:56,529
know

377
00:16:00,869 --> 00:15:57,910
walking along with a nice husky or

378
00:16:02,309 --> 00:16:00,879
something if I'm just walking down the

379
00:16:04,739 --> 00:16:02,319
street on their own and I walked over to

380
00:16:07,019 --> 00:16:04,749
them and said hi I'm Steve is it's a

381
00:16:09,600 --> 00:16:07,029
lunatic yeah but if I grab her and say

382
00:16:10,980 --> 00:16:09,610
oh god your dog's gorgeous I've got I've

383
00:16:13,739 --> 00:16:10,990
now got an excuse to talk to that person

384
00:16:15,480 --> 00:16:13,749
Ryan it's the dog the dog has become a

385
00:16:17,460 --> 00:16:15,490
bridge between those two people because

386
00:16:19,379 --> 00:16:17,470
it's it's a point of commonality as a

387
00:16:20,670 --> 00:16:19,389
point of a common interest you know in

388
00:16:24,540 --> 00:16:20,680
the same way that people who you know

389
00:16:25,679 --> 00:16:24,550
join a stamp collecting society now have

390
00:16:27,809 --> 00:16:25,689
an excuse to talk to other people

391
00:16:30,929 --> 00:16:27,819
because they've got some common ground

392
00:16:33,540 --> 00:16:30,939
to talk about and and so we decided to

393
00:16:35,369 --> 00:16:33,550
try this dog show and it was run with

394
00:16:38,759 --> 00:16:35,379
the local police and with a couple of

395
00:16:40,199 --> 00:16:38,769
dog related charities and dogs homes and

396
00:16:42,449 --> 00:16:40,209
we had the police dogs come in and do a

397
00:16:44,670 --> 00:16:42,459
display jumping through fiery hoops and

398
00:16:46,769 --> 00:16:44,680
all that sort of thing what was amazing

399
00:16:50,460 --> 00:16:46,779
was seeing people who would never ever

400
00:16:52,110 --> 00:16:50,470
ever talk to each other doing so I mean

401
00:16:54,119 --> 00:16:52,120
the thing I remember most of the image

402
00:16:58,079 --> 00:16:54,129
stays with me forever I think was a

403
00:17:00,900 --> 00:16:58,089
little old lady must have been 80s with

404
00:17:03,269 --> 00:17:00,910
her with the Yorkshire Terrier and she's

405
00:17:05,789 --> 00:17:03,279
having a go at this big black lad in a

406
00:17:08,100 --> 00:17:05,799
hoodie who's got some kind of stuff a

407
00:17:09,329 --> 00:17:08,110
bull terrier cross and he's a she's

408
00:17:13,049 --> 00:17:09,339
having to go in because he's dogs too

409
00:17:14,549 --> 00:17:13,059
fat these were people who would have

410
00:17:16,620 --> 00:17:14,559
crossed the road to avoid each other

411
00:17:17,730 --> 00:17:16,630
right in any other circumstance because

412
00:17:19,740 --> 00:17:17,740
she would have been a little bit scared

413
00:17:21,929 --> 00:17:19,750
of him and he would have thought oh an

414
00:17:23,639 --> 00:17:21,939
interfering busybody move but they were

415
00:17:24,919 --> 00:17:23,649
across it and here she was having a go

416
00:17:28,020 --> 00:17:24,929
at him she was in the position of power

417
00:17:30,930 --> 00:17:28,030
because even though he's this huge lab

418
00:17:33,180 --> 00:17:30,940
with this big scary dog dog's overweight

419
00:17:34,799 --> 00:17:33,190
when she's telling him this and and he's

420
00:17:36,500 --> 00:17:34,809
taking advice he's writing down what

421
00:17:39,120 --> 00:17:36,510
he's gonna be buying to feed the dog and

422
00:17:40,860 --> 00:17:39,130
it was the first little [\h__\h] in the

423
00:17:42,930 --> 00:17:40,870
armor of trying to make this right

424
00:17:46,470 --> 00:17:42,940
because if the community comes together

425
00:17:48,240 --> 00:17:46,480
and starts to look after each other then

426
00:17:50,909 --> 00:17:48,250
you know there's all sorts of benefits

427
00:17:52,950 --> 00:17:50,919
apart for the fact that it it takes the

428
00:17:55,740 --> 00:17:52,960
control away from the the emerging gang

429
00:17:57,330 --> 00:17:55,750
it also means that you know this this

430
00:17:58,919 --> 00:17:57,340
huge problem we've got at the moment

431
00:18:00,419 --> 00:17:58,929
with loneliness is epidemic of

432
00:18:03,060 --> 00:18:00,429
loneliness particularly in old people

433
00:18:04,680 --> 00:18:03,070
that that gets dealt with as well people

434
00:18:06,899 --> 00:18:04,690
start feeling more confident about

435
00:18:08,760 --> 00:18:06,909
walking about and then increased

436
00:18:10,110 --> 00:18:08,770
footfall means that there's less chance

437
00:18:11,159 --> 00:18:10,120
for crimes or

438
00:18:13,320 --> 00:18:11,169
right there's more people out on the

439
00:18:15,960 --> 00:18:13,330
street watching what's going on and I

440
00:18:18,060 --> 00:18:15,970
went back to visit that state sort of

441
00:18:20,399 --> 00:18:18,070
about 18 months later surely before I

442
00:18:22,740 --> 00:18:20,409
retired and I can't pretend you know it

443
00:18:24,390 --> 00:18:22,750
was now all lovely and Lala and it was

444
00:18:27,630 --> 00:18:24,400
you know the best place in the world to

445
00:18:29,669 --> 00:18:27,640
live but significantly better without

446
00:18:31,980 --> 00:18:29,679
walking about there was a communal sort

447
00:18:34,740 --> 00:18:31,990
of garden that the residents had put

448
00:18:38,720 --> 00:18:34,750
together and more importantly was talk

449
00:18:41,700 --> 00:18:38,730
about tearing down half that estate and

450
00:18:43,500 --> 00:18:41,710
building different housing there and of

451
00:18:44,730 --> 00:18:43,510
course unfortunately what seems to

452
00:18:47,010 --> 00:18:44,740
happen in the moments they tear down a

453
00:18:48,149 --> 00:18:47,020
council estate and then walk that was

454
00:18:50,940 --> 00:18:48,159
housing that the people who lived there

455
00:18:53,130 --> 00:18:50,950
before can afford living uh-huh so so

456
00:18:55,100 --> 00:18:53,140
there was a it was a campaign going by

457
00:18:57,120 --> 00:18:55,110
people who now they had a community

458
00:19:00,060 --> 00:18:57,130
wanted to stay together if they were

459
00:19:01,529 --> 00:19:00,070
rehoused interesting so yeah so the

460
00:19:02,760 --> 00:19:01,539
community had actually formed to such an

461
00:19:05,610 --> 00:19:02,770
extent that people wanting to stay

462
00:19:07,289 --> 00:19:05,620
together so and crime had dropped

463
00:19:09,210 --> 00:19:07,299
substantially I think I can't really the

464
00:19:13,889 --> 00:19:09,220
exact thing but I haven't in my hair

465
00:19:18,750 --> 00:19:13,899
I've got something about 35% 35% drop in

466
00:19:22,169 --> 00:19:18,760
crime just from a dog show and I'm sure

467
00:19:24,149 --> 00:19:22,179
any police force in the world would be

468
00:19:26,010 --> 00:19:24,159
envious of that sort of a drop in crime

469
00:19:28,380 --> 00:19:26,020
because it solves all sorts of problems

470
00:19:30,269 --> 00:19:28,390
and frees up police time for other

471
00:19:32,880 --> 00:19:30,279
investigations which is always a plus

472
00:19:34,350 --> 00:19:32,890
absolutely this is the point you say

473
00:19:35,760 --> 00:19:34,360
that you know when the police are

474
00:19:37,139 --> 00:19:35,770
running around all the time chasing

475
00:19:38,250 --> 00:19:37,149
their tails try and just trying to catch

476
00:19:40,260 --> 00:19:38,260
up with the number of calls they got

477
00:19:41,820 --> 00:19:40,270
coming in you said you sort of realized

478
00:19:43,110 --> 00:19:41,830
that if you can stop those calls coming

479
00:19:44,730 --> 00:19:43,120
in in the first place the police have

480
00:19:46,590 --> 00:19:44,740
got more time to investigate the crimes

481
00:19:50,010 --> 00:19:46,600
they have got to deal with it yeah and

482
00:19:52,230 --> 00:19:50,020
it's everyone's happy I know in places

483
00:19:54,269 --> 00:19:52,240
where this has been taken on board big

484
00:19:57,510 --> 00:19:54,279
time I mean you talked to the local I

485
00:19:59,580 --> 00:19:57,520
went to Charlotte North Carolina a few

486
00:20:00,960 --> 00:19:59,590
years ago and and did some work with the

487
00:20:03,389 --> 00:20:00,970
local police there where they've adopted

488
00:20:05,039 --> 00:20:03,399
this big time this this whole process of

489
00:20:07,049 --> 00:20:05,049
problem solving it's what they call in

490
00:20:10,620 --> 00:20:07,059
America problem-oriented policing or pop

491
00:20:12,120 --> 00:20:10,630
and and talking to the police officers

492
00:20:14,370 --> 00:20:12,130
there they said they'd never actually

493
00:20:15,389 --> 00:20:14,380
been happier they somebody came in they

494
00:20:18,419 --> 00:20:15,399
thought oh this is a little bit academic

495
00:20:20,669 --> 00:20:18,429
and a bit airy-fairy and you know and I

496
00:20:21,899 --> 00:20:20,679
just want to catch bad guys but once

497
00:20:23,910 --> 00:20:21,909
they got into the swing of it and

498
00:20:26,340 --> 00:20:23,920
realized that they were

499
00:20:28,260 --> 00:20:26,350
now I mean if for no other reason the

500
00:20:30,300 --> 00:20:28,270
community became part of policing

501
00:20:32,250 --> 00:20:30,310
policing with a small P you know they

502
00:20:34,080 --> 00:20:32,260
had all these extra thousand pairs of

503
00:20:36,330 --> 00:20:34,090
eyes helping them to keep the city safe

504
00:20:37,950 --> 00:20:36,340
and right and as a result you know it

505
00:20:40,470 --> 00:20:37,960
was just hugely popular with the police

506
00:20:43,880 --> 00:20:40,480
as always when you look at a problem

507
00:20:45,930 --> 00:20:43,890
you've got to talk to every person

508
00:20:47,370 --> 00:20:45,940
concerned I mean I do whether you

509
00:20:48,960 --> 00:20:47,380
remember this from the talk but I've

510
00:20:51,420 --> 00:20:48,970
said you know every problems got three

511
00:20:52,400 --> 00:20:51,430
components there's there's someone or

512
00:20:55,110 --> 00:20:52,410
something that's causing the problem

513
00:20:56,700 --> 00:20:55,120
there's someone or something that's

514
00:20:58,050 --> 00:20:56,710
affected by the problem and there's a

515
00:21:00,210 --> 00:20:58,060
place in time and space for those to

516
00:21:02,550 --> 00:21:00,220
come together and the secret recurring

517
00:21:04,920 --> 00:21:02,560
problems is to disrupt that triangle you

518
00:21:06,690 --> 00:21:04,930
know with traditional policing a lot of

519
00:21:08,130 --> 00:21:06,700
that was focused on adding the bag by

520
00:21:11,100 --> 00:21:08,140
because if you take away the cause of

521
00:21:12,690 --> 00:21:11,110
the problem then haha no problem except

522
00:21:13,950 --> 00:21:12,700
that there's nearly always someone else

523
00:21:16,770 --> 00:21:13,960
and coming to take that slot there's

524
00:21:19,410 --> 00:21:16,780
always a motivated offender so so if you

525
00:21:21,060 --> 00:21:19,420
can break the other sides as well if you

526
00:21:23,030 --> 00:21:21,070
can change people's behavior so that

527
00:21:25,110 --> 00:21:23,040
they're less likely to be a victim that

528
00:21:26,730 --> 00:21:25,120
means that even if that slot is filled

529
00:21:29,190 --> 00:21:26,740
again they can't operate course you can

530
00:21:31,470 --> 00:21:29,200
change features of the location so the

531
00:21:33,450 --> 00:21:31,480
very reason the bag guys chose that spot

532
00:21:35,130 --> 00:21:33,460
to commit their crime if you can change

533
00:21:37,530 --> 00:21:35,140
that location and take away those

534
00:21:38,880 --> 00:21:37,540
features that again the crime can happen

535
00:21:42,240 --> 00:21:38,890
and if you can hit all three sides at

536
00:21:43,590 --> 00:21:42,250
once bang no problem and and part of

537
00:21:45,000 --> 00:21:43,600
that involves talking to people who

538
00:21:45,570 --> 00:21:45,010
represent all three sides of that

539
00:21:49,230 --> 00:21:45,580
triangle

540
00:21:51,120 --> 00:21:49,240
well it's there's so many aspects to

541
00:21:53,310 --> 00:21:51,130
this and folks I can only truly

542
00:21:55,470 --> 00:21:53,320
recommend the book why did the policeman

543
00:21:57,000 --> 00:21:55,480
cross the road and I believe you can buy

544
00:21:59,330 --> 00:21:57,010
that now of course but I believe it's

545
00:22:02,160 --> 00:21:59,340
coming out the next year in paperback

546
00:22:03,120 --> 00:22:02,170
yeah it's out there in hardback and of

547
00:22:05,820 --> 00:22:03,130
course you can get it from all usual

548
00:22:07,710 --> 00:22:05,830
places book shops and online etc and

549
00:22:09,960 --> 00:22:07,720
yeah understand that they're looking at

550
00:22:12,870 --> 00:22:09,970
bringing the paperback out in I think

551
00:22:14,490 --> 00:22:12,880
June next year which would be nice

552
00:22:16,680 --> 00:22:14,500
because it'll it'll increase the range

553
00:22:24,600 --> 00:22:16,690
in the book so it certainly will make it

554
00:22:27,360 --> 00:22:24,610
cheaper too as opposed to the wait yes

555
00:22:29,280 --> 00:22:27,370
and speaking of books let's say let's

556
00:22:33,030 --> 00:22:29,290
have a quick chat you have a is it a

557
00:22:34,620 --> 00:22:33,040
novel coming up yeah I've made a bit of

558
00:22:35,910 --> 00:22:34,630
a break because I mean apart from doing

559
00:22:38,129 --> 00:22:35,920
all this sort of stuff obviously my

560
00:22:40,350 --> 00:22:38,139
other great love is comedy

561
00:22:41,610 --> 00:22:40,360
for the last sort of eleven years I've

562
00:22:43,860 --> 00:22:41,620
been associated with or have been one of

563
00:22:46,350 --> 00:22:43,870
the writers of the TV show Qi which is

564
00:22:48,269 --> 00:22:46,360
pretty popular in Austria

565
00:22:49,409 --> 00:22:48,279
yeah I've been one of the I've been one

566
00:22:52,409 --> 00:22:49,419
of the script writers for the last four

567
00:22:55,080 --> 00:22:52,419
years and yeah comedy has always been a

568
00:22:57,450 --> 00:22:55,090
thing with me and in amongst writing all

569
00:22:59,100 --> 00:22:57,460
the non-fiction books I've I've always

570
00:23:01,110 --> 00:22:59,110
written stories and we've written novels

571
00:23:03,450 --> 00:23:01,120
and I thought you know what I'm gonna

572
00:23:04,980 --> 00:23:03,460
put a novel out there so of course it's

573
00:23:07,499 --> 00:23:04,990
not completely divorced from policing

574
00:23:11,159 --> 00:23:07,509
because it is a comedy murder mystery

575
00:23:12,810 --> 00:23:11,169
right and and for me the the whole idea

576
00:23:14,610 --> 00:23:12,820
for the book came from the fact that I

577
00:23:16,710 --> 00:23:14,620
love watching murder mystery at reading

578
00:23:18,299 --> 00:23:16,720
murder mystery love Agatha Christie you

579
00:23:20,279 --> 00:23:18,309
know love watching Murder She Wrote and

580
00:23:22,110 --> 00:23:20,289
all these sort of things but of course I

581
00:23:23,850 --> 00:23:22,120
was also a real cop I've been at real

582
00:23:25,799 --> 00:23:23,860
crime scenes been involved in major

583
00:23:27,560 --> 00:23:25,809
investigations how much is that sort of

584
00:23:30,899 --> 00:23:27,570
thing and I always thought to myself

585
00:23:33,029 --> 00:23:30,909
there they're such worlds apart the way

586
00:23:35,490 --> 00:23:33,039
that sort of crime fiction in real life

587
00:23:38,159 --> 00:23:35,500
worked what if I could throw those two

588
00:23:40,409 --> 00:23:38,169
cultures at each other so what I've

589
00:23:43,110 --> 00:23:40,419
written is a book called a murder to die

590
00:23:45,990 --> 00:23:43,120
for which is about a murder that takes

591
00:23:48,119 --> 00:23:46,000
place at a murder mystery convention so

592
00:23:51,600 --> 00:23:48,129
what so what you've got is got all these

593
00:23:54,149 --> 00:23:51,610
all these cosplaying crime fiction fans

594
00:23:56,610 --> 00:23:54,159
wandering around and a real murder takes

595
00:23:59,389 --> 00:23:56,620
place and the police come in to deal

596
00:24:02,669 --> 00:23:59,399
with it would they're very efficient

597
00:24:04,110 --> 00:24:02,679
procedurally based way of doing things

598
00:24:06,060 --> 00:24:04,120
and they're up against all the crime

599
00:24:07,440 --> 00:24:06,070
fiction fans you think ooh I've read

600
00:24:10,169 --> 00:24:07,450
everything by Conan Doyle I can

601
00:24:11,279 --> 00:24:10,179
investigate this too and and a lot of

602
00:24:13,169 --> 00:24:11,289
the humor comes from that clash of

603
00:24:16,110 --> 00:24:13,179
cultures it was a joy to write I've

604
00:24:17,700 --> 00:24:16,120
really enjoyed writing it but it sounds

605
00:24:19,919 --> 00:24:17,710
great it sounds great and that's coming

606
00:24:22,409 --> 00:24:19,929
out next year yeah yeah yeah January the

607
00:24:26,369 --> 00:24:22,419
25th I think it is oh pretty soon folks

608
00:24:28,169 --> 00:24:26,379
I'd noticed already a link to that book

609
00:24:29,789 --> 00:24:28,179
at Amazon at least I'll certainly link

610
00:24:32,850 --> 00:24:29,799
to that in the show notes and I'll link

611
00:24:35,850 --> 00:24:32,860
to the the other book - why did the

612
00:24:39,629 --> 00:24:35,860
policeman cross the road well I'd love

613
00:24:41,369 --> 00:24:39,639
to invite you to come out to Australia

614
00:24:42,899 --> 00:24:41,379
and do a tour of skeptics in the pub but

615
00:24:44,730 --> 00:24:42,909
I'd have to join you just to make sure

616
00:24:44,999 --> 00:24:44,740
it did run smoothly you understand of

617
00:24:46,889 --> 00:24:45,009
course

618
00:24:51,150 --> 00:24:46,899
oh you would and we produce run a

619
00:24:52,650 --> 00:24:51,160
Kickstarter campaign okay

620
00:24:56,160 --> 00:24:52,660
I've just been in the boat and the bar

621
00:24:58,050 --> 00:24:56,170
tab yeah and about the particularly it

622
00:25:00,000 --> 00:24:58,060
sounds it sounds delightful I hope maybe

623
00:25:02,100 --> 00:25:00,010
one day we can make that happen but

624
00:25:04,800 --> 00:25:02,110
until they operate it would be great

625
00:25:06,450 --> 00:25:04,810
look thank you very much for your giving

626
00:25:08,910 --> 00:25:06,460
your time to the sceptic zone folks I

627
00:25:12,780 --> 00:25:08,920
can not recommend that book highly

628
00:25:16,230 --> 00:25:12,790
enough it's a great read and Steven is a

629
00:25:18,150 --> 00:25:16,240
great man to see giving his public talk

630
00:25:20,430 --> 00:25:18,160
so if you have the opportunity to go

631
00:25:23,010 --> 00:25:20,440
along to see him but for now Steven

632
00:25:40,350 --> 00:25:23,020
Colgan all the way from the UK thank you

633
00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:40,360
very much here's some good news from the

634
00:25:44,610 --> 00:25:42,490
Australian skeptics at skeptics dot-com

635
00:25:47,130 --> 00:25:44,620
de a you published on the 25th of

636
00:25:50,580 --> 00:25:47,140
September by Tim Mendham Australian

637
00:25:53,070 --> 00:25:50,590
skeptics Inc offers funds for sceptical

638
00:25:56,700 --> 00:25:53,080
programs and activities Australian

639
00:25:58,770 --> 00:25:56,710
skeptics Inc ASI is committed to

640
00:26:01,020 --> 00:25:58,780
increasing and fostering the skeptical

641
00:26:03,000 --> 00:26:01,030
movement in Australia and consequently

642
00:26:05,430 --> 00:26:03,010
has a history of supporting various

643
00:26:09,150 --> 00:26:05,440
programs around Australia that promote

644
00:26:10,890 --> 00:26:09,160
our aims with this in mind ASI and the

645
00:26:13,380 --> 00:26:10,900
Australian skeptics science and

646
00:26:16,230 --> 00:26:13,390
educational foundation set up the

647
00:26:18,930 --> 00:26:16,240
Australian skeptics grant program which

648
00:26:21,780 --> 00:26:18,940
seeks to identify and support worthy

649
00:26:23,880 --> 00:26:21,790
organizations individuals and events in

650
00:26:26,970 --> 00:26:23,890
the past we have funded a range of

651
00:26:30,180 --> 00:26:26,980
projects including events prizes torques

652
00:26:33,630 --> 00:26:30,190
scientific research speakers costs and

653
00:26:36,210 --> 00:26:33,640
operating costs of groups applications

654
00:26:38,010 --> 00:26:36,220
are now open for grants and seed funding

655
00:26:40,920 --> 00:26:38,020
to individuals and groups who are

656
00:26:43,460 --> 00:26:40,930
looking to set up or maintain skeptical

657
00:26:45,930 --> 00:26:43,470
organizations projects and activities

658
00:26:49,830 --> 00:26:45,940
more information on the program and

659
00:26:53,130 --> 00:26:49,840
application forms are available at WWF

660
00:26:55,440 --> 00:26:53,140
XCOM not a Hugh please note that grant

661
00:26:59,370 --> 00:26:55,450
requests may be approved in full

662
00:27:00,930 --> 00:26:59,380
partially or not at all we give a higher

663
00:27:02,790 --> 00:27:00,940
waiting to

664
00:27:05,370 --> 00:27:02,800
grant applications that include multiple

665
00:27:07,530 --> 00:27:05,380
organizations working together so

666
00:27:10,320 --> 00:27:07,540
applicants might consider teaming up not

667
00:27:12,510 --> 00:27:10,330
just with Australian skeptics but also

668
00:27:15,120 --> 00:27:12,520
with other organizations I'm taking the

669
00:27:17,250 --> 00:27:15,130
same or similar activities to broaden

670
00:27:19,320 --> 00:27:17,260
their impact so there you go if you're

671
00:27:22,350 --> 00:27:19,330
involved in a skeptical activity in

672
00:27:25,320 --> 00:27:22,360
Australia and you are possibly might

673
00:27:40,050 --> 00:27:25,330
need some funding the Australian

674
00:27:42,150 --> 00:27:40,060
skeptics offer might be for you and now

675
00:27:43,230 --> 00:27:42,160
direct from the cafe and Australia's

676
00:27:46,620 --> 00:27:43,240
Science Channel

677
00:27:49,590 --> 00:27:46,630
it's brouhaha science in less time that

678
00:27:57,120 --> 00:27:49,600
it takes to order a coffee with Casey

679
00:27:57,720 --> 00:27:57,130
Harrigan happy 225th birthday michael

680
00:27:59,880 --> 00:27:57,730
faraday

681
00:28:02,400 --> 00:27:59,890
i have to admit it didn't get you

682
00:28:05,070 --> 00:28:02,410
anything but hey thanks for all of the

683
00:28:06,660 --> 00:28:05,080
things he's given us firstly she is for

684
00:28:09,120 --> 00:28:06,670
inventing the electric Murdoch I use

685
00:28:10,230 --> 00:28:09,130
those all the time also I think it's

686
00:28:13,080 --> 00:28:10,240
really cool that you coined the word

687
00:28:14,910 --> 00:28:13,090
electrode anode cathode and ion not

688
00:28:16,710 --> 00:28:14,920
everyone gives us a way to potentially

689
00:28:19,500 --> 00:28:16,720
it's called 54 points in the game of

690
00:28:21,540 --> 00:28:19,510
Scrabble hey how come you get to thank

691
00:28:23,130 --> 00:28:21,550
you for discovering benzene you know

692
00:28:26,040 --> 00:28:23,140
what they say you can never have too

693
00:28:27,720 --> 00:28:26,050
many hydrocarbons and lastly I want to

694
00:28:30,060 --> 00:28:27,730
thank you for the fact that despite

695
00:28:32,100 --> 00:28:30,070
never being offered one you went out of

696
00:28:35,010 --> 00:28:32,110
your way to publicly say that you would

697
00:28:37,530 --> 00:28:35,020
not accept not good that is a baller

698
00:28:39,240 --> 00:28:37,540
move and in your honor I'd like to

699
00:28:41,100 --> 00:28:39,250
publicly say that I couldn't possibly

700
00:28:42,890 --> 00:28:41,110
accept entry into the Rock and Roll Hall

701
00:28:45,530 --> 00:28:42,900
of Fame

702
00:28:47,180 --> 00:28:45,540
in all seriousness michael faraday was

703
00:28:49,130 --> 00:28:47,190
one of the greatest scientific minds of

704
00:28:51,290 --> 00:28:49,140
all time and whether you're inspired by

705
00:28:58,970 --> 00:28:51,300
his rags-to-riches biography we just

706
00:29:01,340 --> 00:28:58,980
grateful for electrophoresis bad day for

707
00:29:33,140 --> 00:29:01,350
more brouhaha and australian science

708
00:29:45,980 --> 00:29:33,150
visit www.surgicalscience.com itunes or

709
00:30:02,039 --> 00:29:49,350
let's all take this with a grain of salt

710
00:30:04,380 --> 00:30:02,049
she's around second it's the first day

711
00:30:05,820 --> 00:30:04,390
of the Congress I mean we you and I have

712
00:30:07,710 --> 00:30:05,830
spent a bit of time together in Prague

713
00:30:10,860 --> 00:30:07,720
and you know and you're all it's still

714
00:30:12,330 --> 00:30:10,870
cheerful and then happy and you don't

715
00:30:14,909 --> 00:30:12,340
seem stressed at all although I know

716
00:30:17,310 --> 00:30:14,919
they're little stresses but how do you

717
00:30:19,169 --> 00:30:17,320
feel so far I think everything's going

718
00:30:21,210 --> 00:30:19,179
great so far everyone is really

719
00:30:22,409 --> 00:30:21,220
motivated and everyone seems to be

720
00:30:24,389 --> 00:30:22,419
having a good time and that's really

721
00:30:26,970 --> 00:30:24,399
important so far we only hear it from

722
00:30:28,710 --> 00:30:26,980
two speakers but I think the rest of the

723
00:30:30,269 --> 00:30:28,720
day will go as well as the morning did

724
00:30:32,940 --> 00:30:30,279
and I think everyone will enjoy this

725
00:30:34,680 --> 00:30:32,950
Congress what are your expectations over

726
00:30:37,380 --> 00:30:34,690
the next few days in terms of I mean

727
00:30:38,700 --> 00:30:37,390
there's an organizer you expect things

728
00:30:40,110 --> 00:30:38,710
that obviously to run smoothly and all

729
00:30:42,480 --> 00:30:40,120
of that but what do you expect people to

730
00:30:44,820 --> 00:30:42,490
get out of the Congress well we packed

731
00:30:47,700 --> 00:30:44,830
many different speakers throughout of

732
00:30:51,630 --> 00:30:47,710
these three days and I think people get

733
00:30:55,320 --> 00:30:51,640
a very wide view of what all skepticism

734
00:30:57,450 --> 00:30:55,330
is about when you're a skeptic which of

735
00:31:00,060 --> 00:30:57,460
all the fields you can actually dabble

736
00:31:01,590 --> 00:31:00,070
in and that's why we have such a broad

737
00:31:04,649 --> 00:31:01,600
topics or it's such a broad selection of

738
00:31:06,720 --> 00:31:04,659
topics that each so everyone can see oh

739
00:31:07,590 --> 00:31:06,730
okay I can do this as a skeptic or at

740
00:31:09,630 --> 00:31:07,600
this

741
00:31:11,039 --> 00:31:09,640
skeptic we start up with religion but

742
00:31:13,320 --> 00:31:11,049
we're going to cover you know biology

743
00:31:16,620 --> 00:31:13,330
we're going to cover media so it's very

744
00:31:17,789 --> 00:31:16,630
very wide read of topic topics and you

745
00:31:20,310 --> 00:31:17,799
think you've got your struck the right

746
00:31:22,500 --> 00:31:20,320
balance in terms of the topics and the

747
00:31:24,180 --> 00:31:22,510
speakers I think we have we will see how

748
00:31:25,650 --> 00:31:24,190
it works out if the chemistry between

749
00:31:27,870 --> 00:31:25,660
the speakers will be good at the panels

750
00:31:29,789 --> 00:31:27,880
and everything but in general I think we

751
00:31:31,799 --> 00:31:29,799
did yeah okay now about the organization

752
00:31:33,810 --> 00:31:31,809
this is the first time that an event of

753
00:31:35,130 --> 00:31:33,820
this kind has been organized by two

754
00:31:37,820 --> 00:31:35,140
different organizations two different

755
00:31:47,520 --> 00:31:40,200
bumps in the road but I think in the end

756
00:31:49,289 --> 00:31:47,530
we're here I think of course we had some

757
00:31:52,320 --> 00:31:49,299
differences in how to do certain things

758
00:31:54,120 --> 00:31:52,330
but in the end we agreed all the

759
00:31:57,419 --> 00:31:54,130
speakers and we agreed on the program

760
00:31:59,760 --> 00:31:57,429
and we especially agree on that we went

761
00:32:02,340 --> 00:31:59,770
to the best Congress as we can and to

762
00:32:04,470 --> 00:32:02,350
give our attendees the best experience

763
00:32:07,350 --> 00:32:04,480
to that that they can have okay so

764
00:32:09,690 --> 00:32:07,360
you're organizing a big event with lots

765
00:32:12,210 --> 00:32:09,700
of speakers lots of attendees and all of

766
00:32:13,770 --> 00:32:12,220
that and from experience sleep isn't

767
00:32:16,409 --> 00:32:13,780
something that you get a lot of in the

768
00:32:18,450 --> 00:32:16,419
last few weeks they're useful so have

769
00:32:19,529 --> 00:32:18,460
you somehow broken the mold and did

770
00:32:20,970 --> 00:32:19,539
manage to get some sleep or you're just

771
00:32:21,510 --> 00:32:20,980
cheerful even though you don't get

772
00:32:23,850 --> 00:32:21,520
enough sleep

773
00:32:26,820 --> 00:32:23,860
no I hold the whole six hours tonight so

774
00:32:28,890 --> 00:32:26,830
I'm very happy okay I think for most

775
00:32:31,380 --> 00:32:28,900
people listening to this we say six

776
00:32:33,740 --> 00:32:31,390
hours poor girl but you say the whole

777
00:32:36,780 --> 00:32:33,750
six hours I think you know

778
00:32:45,300 --> 00:32:36,790
so I will speak to you again after the

779
00:32:48,030 --> 00:32:45,310
conference Claire Klingenberg I speak to

780
00:32:50,580 --> 00:32:48,040
you again this time at the end of the

781
00:32:53,100 --> 00:32:50,590
European skeptics Congress hi you're

782
00:32:55,730 --> 00:32:53,110
still smiling

783
00:32:58,440 --> 00:32:55,740
[Laughter]

784
00:33:01,410 --> 00:32:58,450
just tell me a little bit yeah what's

785
00:33:02,760 --> 00:33:01,420
happened over the last few days I think

786
00:33:04,350 --> 00:33:02,770
everything went great that's the reason

787
00:33:06,180 --> 00:33:04,360
why I'm smiling is because everyone

788
00:33:09,210 --> 00:33:06,190
seems to be happy the speakers were

789
00:33:12,360 --> 00:33:09,220
happy the attendees were happy so of

790
00:33:14,040 --> 00:33:12,370
course the organizers are happy I think

791
00:33:16,740 --> 00:33:14,050
we had a really interesting selection of

792
00:33:20,340 --> 00:33:16,750
speakers and talks from all different

793
00:33:23,280 --> 00:33:20,350
branches of skepticism and I think it

794
00:33:25,170 --> 00:33:23,290
was quite productive and very

795
00:33:28,530 --> 00:33:25,180
stimulating for people who went to see

796
00:33:31,260 --> 00:33:28,540
it do you have anything that you like

797
00:33:32,760 --> 00:33:31,270
particularly unfortunately I didn't see

798
00:33:34,260 --> 00:33:32,770
much of the talks or is always like a

799
00:33:36,330 --> 00:33:34,270
men that had to run somewhere else in a

800
00:33:37,530 --> 00:33:36,340
minute so I look forward to seeing the

801
00:33:39,600 --> 00:33:37,540
talks in YouTube because we're going to

802
00:33:41,070 --> 00:33:39,610
put all the talks on YouTube so then

803
00:33:43,350 --> 00:33:41,080
I'll have actually time to watch them

804
00:33:45,000 --> 00:33:43,360
you have a special challenge in running

805
00:33:46,560 --> 00:33:45,010
this kind of event obviously in that

806
00:33:49,080 --> 00:33:46,570
you're trying to attract people from

807
00:33:52,980 --> 00:33:49,090
multiple countries multiple languages

808
00:33:54,780 --> 00:33:52,990
and into just one of the countries how

809
00:33:56,340 --> 00:33:54,790
did this play out in terms of the kind

810
00:33:59,760 --> 00:33:56,350
of audience that we got here what was

811
00:34:03,740 --> 00:33:59,770
the makeup of the audience that you had

812
00:34:06,660 --> 00:34:03,750
here so we had a very wide variety of

813
00:34:08,010 --> 00:34:06,670
nationalities here but it was a little

814
00:34:09,750 --> 00:34:08,020
bit how we predicted that a lot of

815
00:34:11,820 --> 00:34:09,760
Polish people will come and a lot of

816
00:34:14,520 --> 00:34:11,830
people from Central and Eastern Europe

817
00:34:18,540 --> 00:34:14,530
will come and that pretty much came true

818
00:34:20,310 --> 00:34:18,550
so not many people from overseas came we

819
00:34:21,660 --> 00:34:20,320
had a couple of American guests but not

820
00:34:22,830 --> 00:34:21,670
many and of course we had to you from

821
00:34:25,350 --> 00:34:22,840
Australia and two more people from

822
00:34:27,000 --> 00:34:25,360
Australia so it was a very interesting

823
00:34:29,040 --> 00:34:27,010
variety of people I think was that was

824
00:34:30,960 --> 00:34:29,050
also very nice that all these cultures

825
00:34:33,870 --> 00:34:30,970
and nationalities could meet that's

826
00:34:35,640 --> 00:34:33,880
great now something else happened after

827
00:34:37,770 --> 00:34:35,650
the convention after the conference

828
00:34:39,270 --> 00:34:37,780
ended it was a meeting of EXO the

829
00:34:41,250 --> 00:34:39,280
European Council of sceptical

830
00:34:43,740 --> 00:34:41,260
organizations and

831
00:34:45,149 --> 00:34:43,750
please to say that your then new

832
00:34:48,000 --> 00:34:45,159
president of Excel

833
00:34:50,490 --> 00:34:48,010
I think it's chairman but I guess

834
00:34:53,909 --> 00:34:50,500
chairwoman or third person probably to

835
00:34:55,379 --> 00:34:53,919
be to be correct yes I live in New

836
00:34:56,460 --> 00:34:55,389
Zealand they used to call it I don't

837
00:35:00,090 --> 00:34:56,470
know what they still do but these two

838
00:35:05,820 --> 00:35:00,100
college share entity okay so I'm the

839
00:35:08,099 --> 00:35:05,830
neuter entity of EXO and yep so we will

840
00:35:11,550 --> 00:35:08,109
see what all of that entails is there

841
00:35:13,980 --> 00:35:11,560
anything that you particularly like I

842
00:35:16,260 --> 00:35:13,990
know you know it's you were just elected

843
00:35:19,109 --> 00:35:16,270
for the position minutes ago and

844
00:35:20,460 --> 00:35:19,119
obviously you have a lot a lot of time

845
00:35:22,440 --> 00:35:20,470
to work on the things that you want to

846
00:35:24,420 --> 00:35:22,450
work on is though if you had to choose

847
00:35:27,090 --> 00:35:24,430
one thing they say is at the top of your

848
00:35:29,730 --> 00:35:27,100
priorities what would that be make it so

849
00:35:34,140 --> 00:35:29,740
important I think that's the main

850
00:35:37,260 --> 00:35:34,150
priority because until two years ago

851
00:35:39,720 --> 00:35:37,270
when we were given to Congress organized

852
00:35:42,060 --> 00:35:39,730
I never even heard of EXO even though my

853
00:35:44,220 --> 00:35:42,070
my own organization is a part of exhume

854
00:35:46,160 --> 00:35:44,230
and when we were at the board meeting

855
00:35:49,460 --> 00:35:46,170
that was something we all agreed on that

856
00:35:52,320 --> 00:35:49,470
EXO has to be more relevant it has to be

857
00:35:56,130 --> 00:35:52,330
influential and it has to be known and

858
00:35:59,430 --> 00:35:56,140
to be seen as a partner for not just

859
00:36:00,930 --> 00:35:59,440
European organizations but for all our

860
00:36:03,720 --> 00:36:00,940
skeptical organizations all over the

861
00:36:06,090 --> 00:36:03,730
world who will be happy to do our part

862
00:36:07,740 --> 00:36:06,100
in that partnership Claire thank you

863
00:36:09,540 --> 00:36:07,750
very much and congratulations both on

864
00:36:13,890 --> 00:36:09,550
the great convention and on becoming

865
00:36:15,080 --> 00:36:13,900
president of Excel oh yes thank you very

866
00:36:22,150 --> 00:36:15,090
much thank you

867
00:36:27,640 --> 00:36:25,700
hi this is Heidi Robertson from the

868
00:36:30,520 --> 00:36:27,650
Northern Rivers vaccination supporters

869
00:36:33,050 --> 00:36:30,530
we are a group of concerned citizens

870
00:36:35,720 --> 00:36:33,060
dedicated to promoting good science and

871
00:36:38,810 --> 00:36:35,730
common sense in our region the far north

872
00:36:40,400 --> 00:36:38,820
coast of New South Wales this area are

873
00:36:43,580 --> 00:36:40,410
famous for its natural beauty and

874
00:36:47,060 --> 00:36:43,590
relaxed lifestyle also has the lowest

875
00:36:49,340 --> 00:36:47,070
rates of vaccination in Australia we are

876
00:36:51,680 --> 00:36:49,350
out to change that by challenging the

877
00:36:53,360 --> 00:36:51,690
myths and misinformation and by

878
00:36:56,690 --> 00:36:53,370
providing good evidence-based

879
00:36:58,550 --> 00:36:56,700
information to the community we'd love

880
00:37:02,150 --> 00:36:58,560
for you no matter where you are in the

881
00:37:09,770 --> 00:37:02,160
world to join our fight please visit our

882
00:37:12,740 --> 00:37:09,780
webpage at wwlp.com folk we also have a

883
00:37:15,710 --> 00:37:12,750
link there to our Facebook page tweet us

884
00:37:18,890 --> 00:37:15,720
at in our FAQs supporters

885
00:37:21,160 --> 00:37:18,900
that's VIX and check us out on Wikipedia

886
00:37:25,430 --> 00:37:21,170
by searching for Northern Rivers

887
00:37:38,980 --> 00:37:25,440
vaccination supporters thank you

888
00:37:41,780 --> 00:37:38,990
[Music]

889
00:37:45,670 --> 00:37:41,790
is a story that's been brought to my

890
00:37:50,420 --> 00:37:45,680
attention published it being dependent

891
00:37:53,589 --> 00:37:50,430
www.indium.com k published only 24th of

892
00:37:56,960 --> 00:37:53,599
September 2017 by Rachel Roberts

893
00:37:59,570 --> 00:37:56,970
homeopathic remedies are quote nonsense

894
00:38:02,660 --> 00:37:59,580
and risk significant harm

895
00:38:05,420 --> 00:38:02,670
end quote say 29 European scientific

896
00:38:07,370 --> 00:38:05,430
bodies National Health Service has said

897
00:38:10,130 --> 00:38:07,380
it will stop offering the alternative

898
00:38:14,180 --> 00:38:10,140
treatment which has several high profile

899
00:38:16,670 --> 00:38:14,190
celebrity fans now this is a reasonably

900
00:38:19,300 --> 00:38:16,680
lengthy article so I'll just cover some

901
00:38:22,099 --> 00:38:19,310
of the highlights a scientific

902
00:38:24,140 --> 00:38:22,109
organization intended to influence EU

903
00:38:25,820 --> 00:38:24,150
policy has called for tougher

904
00:38:29,390 --> 00:38:25,830
regulations of alternative medicine

905
00:38:32,240 --> 00:38:29,400
branding homeopathy as quote nonsense in

906
00:38:34,490 --> 00:38:32,250
quote and warning the quote promotion

907
00:38:38,480 --> 00:38:34,500
and the use of homeopathic products

908
00:38:40,550 --> 00:38:38,490
risks significant harms end quote the

909
00:38:44,420 --> 00:38:40,560
statement was made by the european

910
00:38:48,440 --> 00:38:44,430
academy science advisory council e ASAC

911
00:38:50,839 --> 00:38:48,450
an umbrella organization representing 29

912
00:38:54,770 --> 00:38:50,849
national academies in Europe including

913
00:38:56,810 --> 00:38:54,780
the Royal Society in the UK supporters

914
00:38:59,540 --> 00:38:56,820
of homeopathy and herbal medicine

915
00:39:01,849 --> 00:38:59,550
include Prince Charles while Labour

916
00:39:05,720 --> 00:39:01,859
leader Jeremy Corbyn and Health

917
00:39:08,109 --> 00:39:05,730
Secretary Jeremy Hunt are among MPs who

918
00:39:11,359 --> 00:39:08,119
have signed motions in favour of it

919
00:39:14,000 --> 00:39:11,369
celebrities who are reportedly fans of

920
00:39:16,700 --> 00:39:14,010
the treatment include Usain Bolt Paul

921
00:39:20,150 --> 00:39:16,710
McCartney Jennifer Aniston Hillary

922
00:39:23,210 --> 00:39:20,160
Clinton David Beckham and supermodel

923
00:39:25,670 --> 00:39:23,220
Cindy Crawford the council did not mince

924
00:39:28,460 --> 00:39:25,680
its words in its condemnation of

925
00:39:32,420 --> 00:39:28,470
homeopathy which works on the principle

926
00:39:35,450 --> 00:39:32,430
that like cures like and that water can

927
00:39:38,120 --> 00:39:35,460
have memory in a 12-page statement the

928
00:39:40,280 --> 00:39:38,130
group summarized extensive scientific

929
00:39:42,079 --> 00:39:40,290
research and concluded that homeopathy

930
00:39:44,210 --> 00:39:42,089
is scientifically implausible and

931
00:39:46,670 --> 00:39:44,220
produces nothing more than a placebo

932
00:39:48,529 --> 00:39:46,680
effect in patients it said that

933
00:39:50,659 --> 00:39:48,539
homeopathic remedies

934
00:39:53,019 --> 00:39:50,669
been dangerous because they may delay

935
00:39:56,299 --> 00:39:53,029
patients from receiving conventional

936
00:39:58,459 --> 00:39:56,309
medical treatment homeopathic remedies

937
00:40:01,159 --> 00:39:58,469
are taken by people hoping to treat a

938
00:40:04,130 --> 00:40:01,169
wide variety of disorders including

939
00:40:07,309 --> 00:40:04,140
anxiety and asthma and later on the

940
00:40:09,499 --> 00:40:07,319
article says a House of Commons Science

941
00:40:11,870 --> 00:40:09,509
and Technology Committee report on

942
00:40:13,549 --> 00:40:11,880
homeopathy found that homeopathic

943
00:40:16,219 --> 00:40:13,559
remedies performed no better than

944
00:40:18,319 --> 00:40:16,229
placebos and that the principles on

945
00:40:21,199 --> 00:40:18,329
which homeopathy is based are quote

946
00:40:23,929 --> 00:40:21,209
scientifically implausible end quote

947
00:40:25,939 --> 00:40:23,939
last year the US Federal Trade

948
00:40:28,609 --> 00:40:25,949
Commission announced it would start

949
00:40:31,130 --> 00:40:28,619
enforcing tough standards on homeopathic

950
00:40:33,380 --> 00:40:31,140
product labels including making sure

951
00:40:35,779 --> 00:40:33,390
that the labels clearly state there is

952
00:40:42,199 --> 00:40:35,789
no scientific evidence that the products

953
00:40:44,299 --> 00:40:42,209
work of course for many years in

954
00:40:45,769 --> 00:40:44,309
Australia we have lamented the fact that

955
00:40:48,409 --> 00:40:45,779
you could walk into just about any

956
00:40:51,259 --> 00:40:48,419
pharmacy and buy homeopathic products

957
00:40:53,569 --> 00:40:51,269
right off the shelf and I do remember

958
00:40:54,890 --> 00:40:53,579
once years ago and going into pharmacy

959
00:40:57,620 --> 00:40:54,900
will dr. Ricci when we were

960
00:40:59,719 --> 00:40:57,630
investigating these things and asking

961
00:41:01,669 --> 00:40:59,729
the person behind the counter about

962
00:41:05,239 --> 00:41:01,679
homeopathy and they didn't have a clue

963
00:41:07,609 --> 00:41:05,249
what it was or how it should work or who

964
00:41:08,989 --> 00:41:07,619
was supposed to work like many people

965
00:41:12,559 --> 00:41:08,999
they were under the mistaken belief that

966
00:41:14,809 --> 00:41:12,569
it's herbal or natural or contains herbs

967
00:41:17,989 --> 00:41:14,819
or something like this now in my

968
00:41:21,829 --> 00:41:17,999
archives I've got the package scan from

969
00:41:25,429 --> 00:41:21,839
a product called Brauer natural medicine

970
00:41:27,799 --> 00:41:25,439
sleeping insomnia relief granted this

971
00:41:29,269 --> 00:41:27,809
packet is some years old now it's been

972
00:41:31,669 --> 00:41:29,279
in my files for a while I think they've

973
00:41:34,489 --> 00:41:31,679
updated their packaging but the

974
00:41:35,479 --> 00:41:34,499
important point to point out is that on

975
00:41:39,199 --> 00:41:35,489
the back of the pack

976
00:41:42,140 --> 00:41:39,209
it lists active ingredients each glucose

977
00:41:44,239 --> 00:41:42,150
tablet is medicated with and so on at

978
00:41:48,979 --> 00:41:44,249
lists ingredients like capsicum for

979
00:41:51,289 --> 00:41:48,989
example and coffee coffee in two

980
00:41:56,179 --> 00:41:51,299
different dilutions we've got coffee at

981
00:41:58,459 --> 00:41:56,189
4c concentration and coffee at 30 C

982
00:42:00,800 --> 00:41:58,469
concentration and students of homeopathy

983
00:42:04,400 --> 00:42:00,810
and skepticism well know

984
00:42:06,890 --> 00:42:04,410
that these concentrations are fantasy of

985
00:42:09,440 --> 00:42:06,900
course they're so dilute that there's

986
00:42:12,500 --> 00:42:09,450
not even one molecule left if there ever

987
00:42:14,870 --> 00:42:12,510
was one to begin with and a point that's

988
00:42:19,130 --> 00:42:14,880
been brought to our attention many times

989
00:42:21,320 --> 00:42:19,140
in fact and it's a good point is that in

990
00:42:24,770 --> 00:42:21,330
Australia at least there are laws

991
00:42:27,770 --> 00:42:24,780
governing the claims you can make on

992
00:42:31,580 --> 00:42:27,780
products and especially the the

993
00:42:33,860 --> 00:42:31,590
ingredients I'm sure it's a legal

994
00:42:36,260 --> 00:42:33,870
requirement to list ingredients on a

995
00:42:38,480 --> 00:42:36,270
food or medicine package so in a

996
00:42:41,810 --> 00:42:38,490
homeopathic product lists ingredients

997
00:42:43,400 --> 00:42:41,820
that aren't actually there what what

998
00:42:45,710 --> 00:42:43,410
does that say about the law

999
00:42:48,050 --> 00:42:45,720
are they skirting the law are they

1000
00:42:49,900 --> 00:42:48,060
flouting the law is this some lore I

1001
00:42:52,850 --> 00:42:49,910
don't know about where you can list

1002
00:42:55,670 --> 00:42:52,860
imaginary ingredients on a package and

1003
00:42:59,170 --> 00:42:55,680
another point to remember is that there

1004
00:43:02,030 --> 00:42:59,180
is an argument that homeopathy as a

1005
00:43:05,510 --> 00:43:02,040
product doesn't actually exist it's a

1006
00:43:07,960 --> 00:43:05,520
process it's only a process because the

1007
00:43:10,310 --> 00:43:07,970
product produced at the end of it is

1008
00:43:14,150 --> 00:43:10,320
indistinguishable from say a sugar

1009
00:43:16,010 --> 00:43:14,160
tablet so in that respect even though

1010
00:43:19,700 --> 00:43:16,020
this packet in front of me says right at

1011
00:43:23,090 --> 00:43:19,710
the top homeopathic product is it

1012
00:43:27,020 --> 00:43:23,100
homeopathic product indications relief

1013
00:43:31,670 --> 00:43:27,030
of sleeplessness and insomnia dosage

1014
00:43:35,300 --> 00:43:31,680
adults to tablets children 2 to 12 1

1015
00:43:37,670 --> 00:43:35,310
tablet hang on a second in the

1016
00:43:39,410 --> 00:43:37,680
homeopathic world the weaker something

1017
00:43:41,030 --> 00:43:39,420
is the stronger something is so they're

1018
00:43:44,090 --> 00:43:41,040
suggesting that children should take a

1019
00:43:46,520 --> 00:43:44,100
strong and dosage than adults yeah that

1020
00:43:49,370 --> 00:43:46,530
makes sense and it goes on to say if

1021
00:43:53,240 --> 00:43:49,380
symptoms persist consult your health

1022
00:43:57,250 --> 00:43:53,250
care practitioner and it doesn't say if

1023
00:44:01,130 --> 00:43:57,260
symptoms persist consult your doctor or

1024
00:44:05,300 --> 00:44:01,140
pharmacist and indeed in the media now

1025
00:44:08,540 --> 00:44:05,310
the standard disclaimer for any medical

1026
00:44:11,150 --> 00:44:08,550
products headache tablets 2 whatever if

1027
00:44:12,980 --> 00:44:11,160
symptoms persist consult your health

1028
00:44:13,980 --> 00:44:12,990
care practitioner or your health care

1029
00:44:16,079 --> 00:44:13,990
professional

1030
00:44:19,680 --> 00:44:16,089
and of course if that healthcare

1031
00:44:22,200 --> 00:44:19,690
professional includes a homeopath mm-hmm

1032
00:44:25,849 --> 00:44:22,210
I think you see my point anyway

1033
00:44:30,000 --> 00:44:25,859
homeopathy once more on the back foot on

1034
00:44:30,610 --> 00:44:30,010
the rails on the ropes and on the way

1035
00:44:43,430 --> 00:44:30,620
out

1036
00:44:47,130 --> 00:44:43,440
[Music]

1037
00:44:48,900 --> 00:44:47,140
QED 2017 is fast approaching and you

1038
00:44:50,339 --> 00:44:48,910
don't want to miss it in the passage

1039
00:44:52,890 --> 00:44:50,349
acuity has brought you the perils of

1040
00:44:55,020 --> 00:44:52,900
time the origin of recording an escape

1041
00:44:56,940 --> 00:44:55,030
from the Westboro Baptists the sex bias

1042
00:44:59,099 --> 00:44:56,950
of sex science and all manner of other

1043
00:45:01,980 --> 00:44:59,109
science pseudoscience activism

1044
00:45:05,460 --> 00:45:01,990
slacktivism and more plus insects for

1045
00:45:07,410 --> 00:45:05,470
breakfast mmm YUM QED 2017 takes place

1046
00:45:09,900 --> 00:45:07,420
on the 14th and 15th of October in

1047
00:45:12,240 --> 00:45:09,910
Manchester England we've already known

1048
00:45:14,400 --> 00:45:12,250
speakers like Sophie Wilson co-inventor

1049
00:45:16,020 --> 00:45:14,410
of the armed computer chip Simon Singh

1050
00:45:18,510 --> 00:45:16,030
who will be showing how to crack a

1051
00:45:19,890 --> 00:45:18,520
genuine Enigma machine Phil straighten

1052
00:45:21,000 --> 00:45:19,900
talking through the real-life cover-up

1053
00:45:23,760 --> 00:45:21,010
of the Hillsborough tragedy and

1054
00:45:26,070 --> 00:45:23,770
physicists Helen cherski and Tim O'Brien

1055
00:45:28,050 --> 00:45:26,080
we'll have a live show from the para pub

1056
00:45:31,020 --> 00:45:28,060
boys and the whole event will be emceed

1057
00:45:31,560 --> 00:45:31,030
by ace position de Vanek have some

1058
00:45:33,300 --> 00:45:31,570
laughs

1059
00:45:35,550 --> 00:45:33,310
meet some new friends make new

1060
00:45:38,220 --> 00:45:35,560
connections all for only 109 pounds

1061
00:45:40,589 --> 00:45:38,230
living all the mates don't

1062
00:45:43,380 --> 00:45:40,599
podcasts were workshops our Saturday

1063
00:45:46,620 --> 00:45:43,390
night entertainment lots more check out

1064
00:45:57,960 --> 00:45:46,630
QED cognitive org the details will see

1065
00:45:59,430 --> 00:45:57,970
you in October hello everyone this is

1066
00:46:03,569 --> 00:45:59,440
susan gerbic in the guerrilla skepticism

1067
00:46:07,589 --> 00:46:03,579
on wikipedia project I'm at the very end

1068
00:46:11,640 --> 00:46:07,599
of the European skeptic Congress here in

1069
00:46:13,800 --> 00:46:11,650
Waclaw : more smoke they'll say I'd

1070
00:46:15,660 --> 00:46:13,810
better write anyway so it has been a

1071
00:46:17,760 --> 00:46:15,670
fabulous time we've had a really

1072
00:46:19,440 --> 00:46:17,770
terrific time I think everybody would

1073
00:46:23,880 --> 00:46:19,450
agree and I'm here with two of my

1074
00:46:27,560 --> 00:46:23,890
editors and also one of the mentalists

1075
00:46:29,609 --> 00:46:27,570
speakers for the conference Jacob so

1076
00:46:32,460 --> 00:46:29,619
let's see what they have to say

1077
00:46:34,470 --> 00:46:32,470
so walk IDIA who is one of my gso w

1078
00:46:37,290 --> 00:46:34,480
editors would you think well it was

1079
00:46:39,810 --> 00:46:37,300
great Congress I think well I don't

1080
00:46:43,650 --> 00:46:39,820
think it's the first uros con that I've

1081
00:46:47,130 --> 00:46:43,660
been to second skeptic Congress and I

1082
00:46:50,819 --> 00:46:47,140
loved it it had tons of psychology with

1083
00:46:54,870 --> 00:46:50,829
which I loved and had opposite views

1084
00:46:58,559 --> 00:46:54,880
which were interesting and it happens

1085
00:47:01,530 --> 00:46:58,569
Randi so I'm happy but no I think it was

1086
00:47:03,780 --> 00:47:01,540
great it was great meaning so many

1087
00:47:06,870 --> 00:47:03,790
interesting people which I think it's

1088
00:47:11,069 --> 00:47:06,880
what I'm gonna take out of this it's you

1089
00:47:13,770 --> 00:47:11,079
you don't realize how interesting how

1090
00:47:16,920 --> 00:47:13,780
different but how much like the

1091
00:47:20,309 --> 00:47:16,930
community is so you get to learn a lot

1092
00:47:22,170 --> 00:47:20,319
from everybody okay and Ryan who's also

1093
00:47:25,170 --> 00:47:22,180
one of my gso W editors what are you

1094
00:47:28,470 --> 00:47:25,180
guys to say I'm the conference was

1095
00:47:30,420 --> 00:47:28,480
amazing I loved all the folks fantastic

1096
00:47:31,620 --> 00:47:30,430
things from Susan Blackmore from you as

1097
00:47:33,870 --> 00:47:31,630
well so isn't good to meet you as well

1098
00:47:38,269 --> 00:47:33,880
in the flesh for the first time

1099
00:47:40,289 --> 00:47:38,279
and looks like it was the first time

1100
00:47:44,670 --> 00:47:40,299
good to meet you in person for the first

1101
00:47:47,130 --> 00:47:44,680
time and it's also really awesome just

1102
00:47:50,430 --> 00:47:47,140
the you get to talk to so many skeptics

1103
00:47:52,529 --> 00:47:50,440
some of whom we've met at QED before and

1104
00:47:54,239 --> 00:47:52,539
you know you just go down like a house

1105
00:47:55,650 --> 00:47:54,249
on fire straight away and you've got so

1106
00:47:57,599 --> 00:47:55,660
much in common you've got so much common

1107
00:47:59,089 --> 00:47:57,609
ground to start with that you can easily

1108
00:48:01,189 --> 00:47:59,099
get into a really great conversation

1109
00:48:03,870 --> 00:48:01,199
straight away and I really encourage

1110
00:48:05,519 --> 00:48:03,880
like you say Susan get along to

1111
00:48:07,969 --> 00:48:05,529
conferences and you meet a lot of

1112
00:48:11,579 --> 00:48:07,979
like-minded people and have a great time

1113
00:48:13,410 --> 00:48:11,589
so one of the highlights of the one of

1114
00:48:16,430 --> 00:48:13,420
the highlights of the conference I

1115
00:48:22,380 --> 00:48:16,440
thought was that they had an exorcism

1116
00:48:26,219 --> 00:48:22,390
panel and an exorcism movie and a man

1117
00:48:28,229 --> 00:48:26,229
who what would you say he's a believer

1118
00:48:31,140 --> 00:48:28,239
in exorcisms in support of the Catholic

1119
00:48:33,839 --> 00:48:31,150
Church and so on it was it was fantastic

1120
00:48:36,359 --> 00:48:33,849
having him here and listening to how

1121
00:48:38,729 --> 00:48:36,369
people politely debated him and talked

1122
00:48:41,069 --> 00:48:38,739
to him and he stayed the whole

1123
00:48:45,289 --> 00:48:41,079
conference so I would be interested in

1124
00:48:48,509 --> 00:48:45,299
his thoughts but Jacob who is a

1125
00:48:52,499 --> 00:48:48,519
Mentalist right now and from the Czech

1126
00:48:55,859 --> 00:48:52,509
Republic and Jacob put on a mentalism

1127
00:48:59,670 --> 00:48:55,869
show hypnosis mentalism show that kind

1128
00:49:04,319 --> 00:48:59,680
of showed how exorcisms actually could

1129
00:49:06,839 --> 00:49:04,329
just be from suggestion so Jacob yes you

1130
00:49:10,049 --> 00:49:06,849
are right I don't believe in a position

1131
00:49:12,719 --> 00:49:10,059
and I presented my experience with these

1132
00:49:16,049 --> 00:49:12,729
states of minds which are labeled as

1133
00:49:18,689 --> 00:49:16,059
Harold position so and so I presented

1134
00:49:21,269 --> 00:49:18,699
that it is only suggestion your

1135
00:49:22,469 --> 00:49:21,279
imagination yeah your creativity I

1136
00:49:25,079 --> 00:49:22,479
really enjoyed it

1137
00:49:28,289 --> 00:49:25,089
I am happy that in the audience there

1138
00:49:31,769 --> 00:49:28,299
were some people who weren't afraid of

1139
00:49:36,509 --> 00:49:31,779
my presentation because sometimes when I

1140
00:49:40,529 --> 00:49:36,519
presented these things people are afraid

1141
00:49:43,099 --> 00:49:40,539
of me they are scared from this yes they

1142
00:49:47,320 --> 00:49:43,109
are sitting on their chair and when I

1143
00:49:51,240 --> 00:49:47,330
say if you want let's come

1144
00:49:55,870 --> 00:49:51,250
and strange they sitting still and

1145
00:49:58,860 --> 00:49:55,880
doesn't move so I'm very happy that here

1146
00:50:03,340 --> 00:49:58,870
inverse love a lot of people came and

1147
00:50:06,280 --> 00:50:03,350
yeah we enjoy it and we'll just walked

1148
00:50:10,830 --> 00:50:06,290
up to us right now and he came all the

1149
00:50:13,840 --> 00:50:10,840
way from Berlin Berlin but via Russia

1150
00:50:15,490 --> 00:50:13,850
before right I lived in Russia before

1151
00:50:17,740 --> 00:50:15,500
that's correct so what do you think of

1152
00:50:19,930 --> 00:50:17,750
the Congress you came because you came

1153
00:50:23,920 --> 00:50:19,940
because James Randi was here right well

1154
00:50:25,390 --> 00:50:23,930
I came here to meet my friends to see my

1155
00:50:27,580 --> 00:50:25,400
friends and James Randi of course as

1156
00:50:29,950 --> 00:50:27,590
well yeah I think it was a great

1157
00:50:32,170 --> 00:50:29,960
Congress so I felt that the difference

1158
00:50:35,890 --> 00:50:32,180
was that somebody who did not agree was

1159
00:50:37,630 --> 00:50:35,900
here and was really prominently there

1160
00:50:40,180 --> 00:50:37,640
the first day so I think this was

1161
00:50:41,560 --> 00:50:40,190
something that rarely skeptics do I

1162
00:50:43,660 --> 00:50:41,570
think this is also useful because it

1163
00:50:46,030 --> 00:50:43,670
showed that people aren't I able to talk

1164
00:50:47,920 --> 00:50:46,040
to people who they disagree with they

1165
00:50:50,020 --> 00:50:47,930
were like when they were arguing with

1166
00:50:52,750 --> 00:50:50,030
this guy it was clear that people were

1167
00:50:54,100 --> 00:50:52,760
not experienced doing that and I think

1168
00:50:55,780 --> 00:50:54,110
that this is a lesson to all skeptics

1169
00:50:57,400 --> 00:50:55,790
that hey if you want to if you want to

1170
00:50:59,080 --> 00:50:57,410
bring your message to the public you

1171
00:51:00,880 --> 00:50:59,090
have to really go for it you have to

1172
00:51:04,020 --> 00:51:00,890
learn how to do that so I think this was

1173
00:51:06,040 --> 00:51:04,030
really interesting this was new yeah I

1174
00:51:07,690 --> 00:51:06,050
really I think that was the highlight

1175
00:51:09,580 --> 00:51:07,700
well actually there's so many wonderful

1176
00:51:11,950 --> 00:51:09,590
things happening at this conference and

1177
00:51:12,430 --> 00:51:11,960
but I do think that stands out of my

1178
00:51:16,600 --> 00:51:12,440
mind

1179
00:51:19,600 --> 00:51:16,610
that having an exorcist related person

1180
00:51:21,880 --> 00:51:19,610
here to stay through the whole Congress

1181
00:51:23,860 --> 00:51:21,890
and I guess he went out with beers and

1182
00:51:25,360 --> 00:51:23,870
had beers with people and things yeah he

1183
00:51:28,030 --> 00:51:25,370
seemed like he was a very person will

1184
00:51:31,420 --> 00:51:28,040
come kind of guy but he as soon as he

1185
00:51:33,730 --> 00:51:31,430
got on the stage I said what what wait

1186
00:51:35,350 --> 00:51:33,740
wait wait wait is it I didn't know if it

1187
00:51:37,120 --> 00:51:35,360
was his accent that I was having trouble

1188
00:51:39,220 --> 00:51:37,130
with understanding what he was saying or

1189
00:51:41,410 --> 00:51:39,230
if it was I just thought it was a joke

1190
00:51:43,660 --> 00:51:41,420
like he's gonna bring his case you know

1191
00:51:48,940 --> 00:51:43,670
layth laid out and then explained why

1192
00:51:52,060 --> 00:51:48,950
it's wrong no it was very interesting so

1193
00:51:55,170 --> 00:51:52,070
anyway skeptic zone listeners and we we

1194
00:52:16,500 --> 00:51:55,180
all are saying hello from Maria so

1195
00:52:18,930 --> 00:52:16,510
of Poland thanks guys hey svenska

1196
00:52:21,000 --> 00:52:18,940
skeptical elevator elevator scope for

1197
00:52:22,680 --> 00:52:21,010
building in the battle none hangar of

1198
00:52:25,230 --> 00:52:22,690
the skeptic zone the Tanakh saw a

1199
00:52:28,200 --> 00:52:25,240
fearful dog pop science quiz of

1200
00:52:31,559 --> 00:52:28,210
skeptical Kevin Thomas Valley Queen pave

1201
00:52:33,870 --> 00:52:31,569
Punto from des efforts Pauline vuvuzela

1202
00:52:36,359 --> 00:52:33,880
cow look out for any ohonta Malanda top

1203
00:52:38,549 --> 00:52:36,369
comb warm the door installed tarentines

1204
00:52:43,290 --> 00:52:38,559
non-local Fanning button to start I am

1205
00:52:46,260 --> 00:52:43,300
12 your bottom add a new hello all

1206
00:52:47,910 --> 00:52:46,270
skeptics in Sweden I'm sure you already

1207
00:52:50,400 --> 00:52:47,920
know that the Swedish skeptics

1208
00:52:52,680 --> 00:52:50,410
Association not only is a big fan of the

1209
00:52:55,140 --> 00:52:52,690
skeptic zone but that we also organize

1210
00:52:59,329 --> 00:52:55,150
lectures pop science quiz and skeptics

1211
00:53:03,630 --> 00:52:59,339
in the pub all over the country go to

1212
00:53:06,180 --> 00:53:03,640
WWE fpse to see what our seven local

1213
00:53:07,890 --> 00:53:06,190
chapters are up to and if you live in a

1214
00:53:09,690 --> 00:53:07,900
place where there is no local chapter

1215
00:53:15,060 --> 00:53:09,700
why not start one yourself

1216
00:53:15,070 --> 00:53:25,669
[Music]

1217
00:53:29,639 --> 00:53:28,289
thank you for listening to the skeptic

1218
00:53:32,519 --> 00:53:29,649
zone now at the top of the show I said

1219
00:53:34,919 --> 00:53:32,529
we had a message come in via voice bite

1220
00:53:36,539 --> 00:53:34,929
and if you want to use voice bite to

1221
00:53:40,739 --> 00:53:36,549
send the skeptic zone a comment or a

1222
00:53:43,319 --> 00:53:40,749
question please do so links on skeptic

1223
00:53:46,289 --> 00:53:43,329
zone TV or you just go to your App Store

1224
00:53:49,889 --> 00:53:46,299
or your Google store and get the

1225
00:53:53,069 --> 00:53:49,899
application voice bite record your short

1226
00:53:55,620 --> 00:53:53,079
question tag it with skeptic zone and

1227
00:53:57,449 --> 00:53:55,630
that gets straight to me it's a really

1228
00:54:00,269 --> 00:53:57,459
convenient system for sending voice

1229
00:54:04,259 --> 00:54:00,279
messages anyway anyway here's the latest

1230
00:54:05,609 --> 00:54:04,269
one that's come in I Richard I was just

1231
00:54:07,949 --> 00:54:05,619
wondering whether the skeptics own

1232
00:54:11,039 --> 00:54:07,959
podcast is going to be part of skeptic

1233
00:54:14,339 --> 00:54:11,049
on in November in Sydney I hope so

1234
00:54:16,289 --> 00:54:14,349
and that message was from Rebecca Jones

1235
00:54:19,859 --> 00:54:16,299
listen Rebecca thank you for that and

1236
00:54:23,489 --> 00:54:19,869
the answer is yes the skeptic zone will

1237
00:54:25,799 --> 00:54:23,499
be at the skeptic on in November in

1238
00:54:27,689 --> 00:54:25,809
Sydney we're working on the details now

1239
00:54:30,029 --> 00:54:27,699
but there should be a live session a

1240
00:54:32,099 --> 00:54:30,039
live recording of the skeptic zone

1241
00:54:34,409 --> 00:54:32,109
starring some of your favorite reporters

1242
00:54:36,959 --> 00:54:34,419
from the show looking forward to that

1243
00:54:38,489 --> 00:54:36,969
more details in the coming weeks so

1244
00:54:40,049 --> 00:54:38,499
those people who are coming to skeptic

1245
00:54:42,709 --> 00:54:40,059
on and would like to see a live

1246
00:54:45,959 --> 00:54:42,719
recording of the skeptic zone podcast

1247
00:54:47,939 --> 00:54:45,969
you're in luck oh and if you do want to

1248
00:54:52,229 --> 00:54:47,949
send a voice message to the show of

1249
00:54:54,359 --> 00:54:52,239
course if you tagged it a skeptic zone

1250
00:54:56,609 --> 00:54:54,369
you can also tag it Maynard or Taggert

1251
00:54:59,549 --> 00:54:56,619
Heidi or tag it Mandy or just say in

1252
00:55:01,589 --> 00:54:59,559
your message a question for a question

1253
00:55:04,349 --> 00:55:01,599
for me not where do you get your hair

1254
00:55:07,679 --> 00:55:04,359
gel or something like that or a question

1255
00:55:11,069 --> 00:55:07,689
for Heidi a question to manually Noble

1256
00:55:14,009 --> 00:55:11,079
about dietary information she might be

1257
00:55:17,129 --> 00:55:14,019
able to help you with a question to dr.

1258
00:55:19,589 --> 00:55:17,139
H E or a question to Ron say gave the

1259
00:55:20,699 --> 00:55:19,599
globe trotting around to give look

1260
00:55:24,049 --> 00:55:20,709
forward to getting lots of those

1261
00:55:26,129 --> 00:55:24,059
questions and comments via voice bite

1262
00:55:28,409 --> 00:55:26,139
coming up on next week's show as

1263
00:55:31,909 --> 00:55:28,419
mentioned before I ran say 'give chats

1264
00:55:34,709 --> 00:55:31,919
to James Randi and Massimo Polidoro oh

1265
00:55:37,920 --> 00:55:34,719
and just before I go speaking about

1266
00:55:39,660 --> 00:55:37,930
doing live events I've

1267
00:55:42,390 --> 00:55:39,670
along the grapevine along the whisper

1268
00:55:44,700 --> 00:55:42,400
the word on the street is soon sometime

1269
00:55:47,880 --> 00:55:44,710
in November looks like there will be a

1270
00:55:50,250 --> 00:55:47,890
live recording of bunga bunga with

1271
00:55:53,010 --> 00:55:50,260
Maynard and Tim Ferguson Tim from the

1272
00:55:54,480 --> 00:55:53,020
Doug Anthony all-stars of course now

1273
00:55:57,450 --> 00:55:54,490
Banga Banga of course is the

1274
00:55:59,190 --> 00:55:57,460
award-winning comedy podcast and i think

1275
00:56:00,750 --> 00:55:59,200
that's gonna be a great evening or

1276
00:56:04,200 --> 00:56:00,760
afternoon I'm not sure it's all being

1277
00:56:06,390 --> 00:56:04,210
put together at the moment more details

1278
00:56:09,210 --> 00:56:06,400
as soon as I know but a live recording

1279
00:56:11,130 --> 00:56:09,220
of bunga bunga with Maynard and Tim

1280
00:56:13,079 --> 00:56:11,140
Ferguson as soon as I know all the

1281
00:56:16,200 --> 00:56:13,089
details I'll let you know and it sounds

1282
00:56:18,120 --> 00:56:16,210
like it will be a really fun event in

1283
00:56:21,809 --> 00:56:18,130
the meantime you can check out Maenads

1284
00:56:23,910 --> 00:56:21,819
podcasts at Maynard com got a you but

1285
00:56:27,210 --> 00:56:23,920
for this week with Henrietta and more

1286
00:56:29,640 --> 00:56:27,220
The Skeptical Cats not here where are

1287
00:56:32,280 --> 00:56:29,650
they oh I think they're just outside the

1288
00:56:34,200 --> 00:56:32,290
door waiting for their breakfast

1289
00:56:41,370 --> 00:56:34,210
for this week this is Richard Saunders

1290
00:56:43,109 --> 00:56:41,380
signing off from Sydney Australia you've

1291
00:56:45,750 --> 00:56:43,119
been listening to the skeptic zone

1292
00:56:52,440 --> 00:56:45,760
podcast please visit our website at

1293
00:56:55,940 --> 00:56:52,450
wwlp.com tax and to access the bat

1294
00:56:58,589 --> 00:56:55,950
catalogue of episodes going back to 2008

1295
00:57:01,890 --> 00:56:58,599
you can follow the skeptic zone podcast

1296
00:57:04,170 --> 00:57:01,900
on twitter at skeptic zone visit our

1297
00:57:05,059 --> 00:57:04,180
facebook page or leave a review on

1298
00:57:07,740 --> 00:57:05,069
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1299
00:57:11,640 --> 00:57:07,750
you can also support the skeptic zone

1300
00:57:14,220 --> 00:57:11,650
via patreon or PayPal you can be part of

1301
00:57:18,630 --> 00:57:14,230
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1302
00:57:21,990 --> 00:57:18,640
app at Voice bite comm and using the

1303
00:57:25,380 --> 00:57:22,000
hashtag skeptic zone the skeptic zone

1304
00:57:27,089 --> 00:57:25,390
podcast is an independent production the

1305
00:57:29,250 --> 00:57:27,099
views and opinions expressed on the

1306
00:57:31,559 --> 00:57:29,260
skeptic zone are not necessarily those

1307
00:57:33,350 --> 00:57:31,569
of Australian skeptics or any other